INC.: Not having money, bootstrapping -- does it put you in positions of having close calls ethically? You've never been tempted to shortcut? Anita, you accused Harry of stealing the Arthur Anderson folder.
RODDICK: Well, if it was a criminal act, I wouldn't do it, but you could put AA on the folder or you could put Arthur Johnson or something. It doesn't mean anything, but you certainly don't ever do criminal acts, I don't think, unless you're stupid.
BOWEN: Never shortcut your customers -- that's what you're talking about.
INC.: I'm talking about a fine line between deception and impression. You have a prospective franchisee come into the store and you stage a little bit of theater on the phone with a friend, creating the illusion that the company is much larger than it is. Is that deception?
HENDRICKS: Are you kidding? You don't think GM does that? When you're having your picture taken, you pull your gut in. Is that illegal?
QUADRACCI: Puffing is not something we invented.
INC.: You still think of yourself as a bootstrapper?
QUADRACCI: Yeah. Maybe it will change with my kids, but once you're a bootstrapper, you're always a bootstrapper. You just live that way.
BOWEN: I don't buy expensive office furniture and things like that. I don't want people to think that we're too successful.
INC.: But if you like nice furniture and can afford it now, as most of you can, why not?
HENDRICKS: We still buy used, but nice, furniture. My desk came from somebody that had gone bankrupt. I've thought about the tears that had to fall on that desk, and it's something that reminds me everyday I'm not going to let this happen to me.
RODDICK: The staff doesn't want me in fur coats or in big cars or acting like I've got the million dollars that I have. They want me to be as I am. Other people, the City [London's Wall Street], want me to be respectable. So you are dealing with multitudes of different people. There are so many planks in the platform of running a business.
HENDRICKS: Daily you meet somebody down by a hamburger shop, and an hour later you're playing multimillionaire.
I want to remember when I didn't have any money at all, so my wife and I rent one of those little resorts in northern Wisconsin -- no pizzazz, no phones, pull-out coil spring mattress. We get a rowboat and go out for an afternoon with a can of beans, because that's the way we used to do it. We do that three or four times a year; I don't want to forget where I came from -- not that it was bad. I just want to know that I can go back.
INC.: But you do spend money now on yourselves?
HENDRICKS: I always wanted a boat, and now I'm having a hard time. I'd like a 60-or 70-foot boat, but it's against everything I've stood for. The reason I want a boat is that I want to know my managers better, and if I invite them to my home, they're uncomfortable. A motel is too cold. Well, if I buy this boat, I'll have them come, and I'll say, "If you bring any more than shorts and a T-shirt, you can't come aboard." I was going to call it the Friendship and have glasses made I could give to guests. But I'm worried. It's a culture crisis I'm going through. I'm afraid they'll say, "Look at that fat-cat bastard."
RODDICK: If it bothers you to have money or to spend it on things you want, keep what you want or spend it, but give more away. Give away to social causes as much as your boat costs. I can guarantee that you will wake up in the morning and not have a problem with your boat.
BOWEN: I put on my jeans occasionally and get in the plant and do the same work as my people -- my manual printers -- I get back there and work a day with them. It reminds me of how hard I had to work manually. I don't have to do that anymore, but I want to remember it. It also shows my people that I understand the work they're doing and how hard it is and that I appreciate it. They like to see me back there. We have a real good relationship.
JACKSON: But by definition, we're different.
QUADRACCI: That's right.
JACKSON: By being entrepreneurs and having taken the risks and done all the things that we've done, we're not like most of the people in this country. You're trying to be like they are, but you're not anymore.
INC.: Given how passionately all of you feel about this bootstrapping and how it's affected your businesses and your lives, what's it done to your attitude toward passing your wealth on to your children?
JACKSON: I have a nice will.
BOWEN: I've already given my sons a part of the business because they've played such an important role in it. They began working for me when they were 14 or 13, and I felt they've had as much part in building the business as I did.
INC.: But if you pass on the wealth, you deprive your kids of the opportunity to do what you've done.
HENDRICKS: I have seven children in the business, plus one son-in-law and one daughter-in-law. Nine. Every one has a key post, a top post. It scares me to death, the idea of giving them the money. I just don't know what to do. I think about the generation skip, but then I'll ruin my grandkids.
QUADRACCI: Give it away.
RODDICK: I deprived my kids of a normal childhood setting by my not being constantly at the house, so I feel I've compensated. I've given them a trust. My own wealth, i.e., the shares that I own, that they will not have. That is being given away.
QUADRACCI: My children did suffer. The milkman wouldn't deliver. We were afraid to go to the grocery store because we did not pay the bills, and they remember that. They know what we created was out of ashes. On the other hand, it would be absurd for me to insist they work their way through college. I don't want them to have to go that way.
HENDRICKS: My kids did work their way. I paid whatever the state tuition was, and they all left the state and went to colleges elsewhere. My oldest daughter was very upset with me about that. She has two sons and says, "Dad, I understand what you did now."
INC.: All of you except Mary Anne could walk away from your businesses now. You don't need any more money.
BOWEN: I've already started two or three other things.
RODDICK: I want to know why anybody would want to give up their business after they started it. I don't understand why.
HENDRICKS: Your employees drain you. The more employees, the more they drain.
QUADRACCI: Or clients.
HENDRICKS: You get older and tireder. You get worn out. You say, "What the hell for? When I was on top of the mountain, hell, it didn't look any better than when I was at the bottom."
My main concern about my company is that if I did get out, somebody has to carry on with the employees in mind. To hell with the money. I realize how little use money is.
JACKSON: Because you have it.
INC.: What would you say back when you were sweating out bootstrapping your own business if you had read a magazine article in which a bunch of successful entrepreneurs sat around talking about how it builds character?
QUADRACCI: It gives your company a soul.
INC.: Your response back then, though?
RODDICK: The last thing in the bloody world I would have wanted to read about were platitudes like character building. I wanted pages of tricks: 20 things to get your customers into the shop, 40 things that told how to sell product in a different way, creative ideas on how to sell or market that store, how to get into the press.
QUADRACCI: Dog and pony shows.
RODDICK: We're all Barnums.
